Friday, 6 February 2009

Arguing with a Creationist. Again.

Scientific fact?
Yes. Funnily enough, evolution has an awful lot of evidence.

You're a Christian?! boy that was really funny...
I detect a 'No True Scotsman' here.

Evolution can not be demonstrated...
Wrong. It can and has, both in nature and in the lab. Do your research.

so it's no science it's belief
Wrong. Evolution is not a belief, it is scientific fact that one accepts or does not accept. You are apparently of the latter.

Being a belief makes it a religion...
Wrong. Evolution is a scientific fact. To be a religion, it would have to have things like 'holy days', 'scripture' , a ';punishment and reward' system, a 'God or Gods' as well as many other things, which it in fact DOES NOT HAVE.

Now the questions is... who's religion is this?
Because it's NOT a religion, this question makes no sense. First PROVE that it is a religion. As you cannot, you should stop this line of (non)reasoning.

It is obvious it isn't God's religion
You're right - it's not a religion at all. And which 'God' are we talking about here? If you mean the Abrahamic God, then prove he exists. As you cannot, you should stop this line of (non)reasoning. (And this little snippit has nothing to do with the fact of evolution anyway - plenty of religious people accept evolution, plenty of atheists don't.)

You'll be surprised to know how much I know about evolution... I studied it in college... and I was one of the best students there... come and ask the teachers
Annecdotal at best - and has nothing to do with anything.

But studying it really close discovered how stupid this theory is...
In your opinion - and I bet you didn't really. Or you studied it from a theist perspective, rather than an objective one. Again - your opinion holds no bearing as to whether evolution is fact or not.

because that is what it is: a theory, an opinion...
You appear to be under the missaprehension that 'theory' is the lowest common-demonenator in scientific literature, when actually it's damn near the highest. A 'theory' is NOT an opinion, it is what explains a group of data or information, makes predictions and masters phenomena. Do you think of the 'Theory of Gravity' as 'opinion'? Do you think of the 'Theory of Magnetism' as 'opinion'? Do you think of 'Atomic Theory' as 'opinion'? I could go on.

something that it can't be demonstrated...
Yes it can. And has been, multiple times, both in nature and in the lab. Do your research. It's not hard, I'm sure you know how to use Google.

my fear is that you won't listen and you're not willing to listen without bias.

and be careful what you choose and who you choose to believe.
Hrm. Threats. Very nice.

For me is more plausible to believe all things were created by God,
Fine. But your incredulity has no baring whatsoever on the fact of evolution.

than to believe what evolutionism says that life appeared from what? (minerals and water)
Firstly, there is no such thing as 'evolutionism'. Secondly, the Theory of Evolution describes what happend to life AFTER it happened. You want Abiogenesis, if you want to know how life started - and even then, 'minerals and water' is a terrible StrawMan. Also -

Genesis 2, verse 7: 'And the LORD GOD formed man of the dust of the ground...'

Your God apparently made people out of 'dust of the ground' - which is what...? That's right, MINERALS. Abiogenesis, however, DOES NOT say life started from 'minerals and water'. Go and look it up.

For me is more likely to believe that I as a very ultra complex human organism and human being was created by God and not appeared from rock (minerals).
Again with both the 'Argument from Incredulity' and the 'Straw Man'.

It is more likely to believe that planets and the entire universe was created by God than to believe in that stupid Big Bang.
Again with both the 'Argument from Incredulity' and the Big Bang has nothing to do with Evolution. If you want to talk about the Big Bang, talk to Cosmologists and Theoretical Physicists.

I'll give you one simple argument for you to see that true science contradicts evolutionism.
No, I'm pretty sure you're going to give me some Creationist Drivel, because NO SCIENCE contradicts Evolution.

It is known that most of the planets and other celestial bodies spin clockwise.
Wrong. If you mean ALL the planetary bodies in the universe? Then you're so wrong you don't even know how wrong you are. If you mean within our solar-system, then you are a little bit right. What actually happens is that the planets spin in the same direction that they orbit the central star. But over-all, you're basically wrong. And I can now see where you're about to go with this Creationist Drivel.

It is said that the Big Bang micro-sphere (smaller than a dot and all that blah blah) was spinning clockwise too.
By whom? Cite resources and information please.

Now, true science says that everything that come off from a rotating thing keeps that rotating direction because of inertia force.
Oh dear, I DO know where you're going with this, and it really is just another Creationist missunderstanding. Complete Drivel. It's been tried before, by 'better' Creationists than you, and smacked down by better atheists than me.

"Big Bang point of mater" was rotating counter-clockwise and exploded so everything now in universe should rotate counter-clockwise.
It didn't 'explode' - it EXPANDED and is still EXPANDING. There is a difference, look it up.

But NO! Even in our own solar system there are 2 planets that don't rotate counter-clockwise being in contradiction with that physics PROVEN law. (those planets are Venus and Uranus)
You finally got to the point! Venus and Uranus were hit by large - planet sized - objects early in their development, which knocked them off axis. It's called 'Retrograde Rotation' and in fact, is very rare. (Pretty cool that we've got two in our system, then!) Simple enough for you? Anyway, each Solar System's planets will spin in the direction that they orbit the central star - NOT 'clockwise' or some arbitrary spin you want to set on the Big Bang. Each star, in each gallaxy, spins in whichever way it formed, not because of the Big Bang.

So, I don't prefer to choose to BELIEVE something that can't be demonstrated even if it comes in contradiction with something that can be demonstrated.
You have to believe it if you don't want too. But it's there for when you do feel like accepting it as fact.

I can't choose to believe in evolutionism.
You don't 'choose to believe', you 'accept', - and it's not 'evolutionism', it's 'evolution'.

There are a lot more evidence against evolutionism...
Wrong. There really isn't. There is only Creationist Drivel - all of which has been debunked repeatedly.

About skeletons well, they found lots of dinosaur tracks in same aged geological layers AMONG with HUMAN TRACKS. In the same aged layer
Wrong. This is a Creationist Myth. Some were dinosaur tracks with similarities to human footprints, some were outright hoaxes. Do your reasearch. Google is your friend.

People forget about the flood and about the destructive force that water can have...
Ugh. The Flood? Seriously? This myth has been debunked so many times, it's laughable.

I don't dictate nothing... Bible tells me... and yeah maybe I sound radical but we should come back to read the Bible and search our sols.
Ugh - and if the Bible told you to kill your children, would you do it? I actually have three copies of the Bible thanks - and two copies of the Mormon Bible and a copy of the Koran. None of them have told me anything interesting. And it's spelt 'soul' by the way.

Big Bang has nothing to do with evolution? I'm sorry to tell you but that's the most stupid affirmation I've ever read related to this subject.
You show your ignorance with this statement. Evolution is studied by biologists. The Big Bang is studied by Cosmologists and Physicists. No, it has nothing to do with Evolution. Evolution is a process that did not begin until life had already started, the Big Bang happened many billions of years before that took place. Evolution has NOTHING to do with the Big Bang.

Evolution is a straw theory, like it or not
Wrong. Evolution is a Biological Fact. If you don't believe me, stop taking any and all medication and rely on 'Faith Healers' for any illness. Medicine would be impossible without the underlying understanding given by the Theory of Evolution.

You and the other pro-evolution scientist will have to make up better lies to fool people.
Projection. I am not the one lying.

Evolution doesn't stand a chance.
Wrong. It stands every chance, for it has evidence, while your 'Creationist Hypothesis' does not.

About the universe you seem to know more than doctors in science, astronomy and geography that were my teachers that is hilarious...
I claim no such thing. I have simply read around the subjects an awful lot. I find Evolution and Astronomy to be facinating. Your contention that I claim to know more than your teachers is an Argument from Ridicule. I claimed no such thing, and you are making assertions based on anecdotal non-evidence.

You come with this stupid aberrations to whom?

if I were a driver maybe you could fool me but it's my field of study and I graduated that college being one of the best students
Anecdotal, and also impugning the intelligence of drivers.

So all the stuff related about bng bang what you said contradicts what scientists say

Evolutionism is the word in Romanian and my Romanian-English dictionary translates it that way... it's a spelling error in that dictionary... I hope you don't mind it.
Well then, correct yourself from now on.

Yeah sure...there were dinosaurs with human feet?
Not what I said. StrawMan.

so then I guess we evolved from dinosaurs - that's cool
We and dinosaurs share a common ancestor. If you studied evolution as well as you claim, you would know this.

Well the marine fossils on top of the mountains are just a simple and obvious proof for the flood.
Wrong. They are evidence of Tectonic Plate Activity. Look it up.

I know what the stupid evolution theory says about that I studied it and I know how weak it is
That's also NOT an evolutionary explanation - it's a geological explanation - finding fossils of sea creatures on mountain tops says nothing about how they evolved, but everything about how the Tectonic Plates work. Obviously, you have been reading the wrong things.

I see that your continuing to check the spelling errors... I'm sorry for them... Don't you have spelling errors?! what more languages do you know? How good do you know them...
It has nothing to do with how well one speaks a language, and everything to do with how well one uses that language to convey a message. You should go through your post before clicking 'send' to make sure it is clear, coherent, and not up for confusion. By not doing these things, you make yourself look ridiculous.

Let's do something interesting...let's chat in Romanian so I can see if your better in Romanian than I'm in English
I never said I could speak Romanian and I never said anything about your ability to speak English. Read my previous statement.

Yeah I guess you are that kind of person that claims never made a spelling mistake... Have a question for ya... Do you know to speak in Romanian at least 25% as I know to speak in English?! you are so ignorant and ridiculous whit all the other stuff you wrote... it doesn't deserve a reply...
It's the general idea of evolution that applies in all sciences but you choose to be a smart ass and pretend you didn't understood :)
so next comment in Romanian please.. if not, shut up! And prove that you're smart enough to learn another language other than your own. As the "ridiculous" I did ;)

Of course I make mistakes, every one does. This is why I suggested going back through your post before hitting 'send'.

I notice how you're not even attempting to rebut anything I've said. All you are doing is hiding behind your 'I learned another language, you should too!' thing.

If you want to talk about these subjects, on a website that is predominantly in English, you are the one who has to learn to accomodate.

I'm sure I'd love to learn Romanian, but I've limited myself to French, Japanese and British Sign Language - I'm still learning, though. My Fiance speaks some of both Russian and German. My parents both speak some German and French.

Of course, none of this has any bearing on the validity of my arguments.

You are the one with the extraordinary claims, you have to provide the extraordinary evidence. You have failed to do so. You have proven nothing. Now, because of this, you hide behind your hurt feelings.

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